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In this episode of The Turn On, Erica and Kenrya read from "Black Lesbians—We Are the Revolution!" and talk pegging, learning from our partners and if our ancestors watch us fuck.
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Kenrya: Come here. Get off.
Erica: Welcome to this week's episode of The Turn On. Today we will be reading a number of poems. I was about to say a number of poetries. A number of poetries from the anthology called “Black Lesbians—We Are the Revolution,” which was edited by JP Howard and Amber Atiya for Sinister Wisdom in winter of 2018. Sit back, relax. Get your wine, get your weed, get your whatever you need, and enjoy.
Kenrya: “Sinister Wisdom's Black Lesbians—We Are the Revolution.” Edited by JP Howard and Amber Atiya. “Questioning” by Vanesa Evers. I kissed her, not the other way around like my mother told me it would happen. She said the lesbian was aggressive, didn't care if you liked girls or not, they would attack you when you least expected it, but I kissed her and felt heaven inside. Should I tell my mother I am the aggressive lesbian she warned me about.
Kenrya: “Non/fiction” by Vanesa Evers. You ask me to kneel down between legs and suck what was never given to you but you don't want it really. Just want me spreading my tongue's liquid over the strapped firmness. I call you daddy, even though neither of us like ours, but daddy, you feel so good in my mouth. I stay down there until you release the back of my head, wanting me to believe something slid down my throat. It's okay though. I never liked it anyway.
Kenrya: “Black Moon” by Akinfe Fatou. I study the choreography of your heartbeat, your perfect saunter, what it means to be Black, to be lesbian and fearless. To be proud, daring to heal, save and love ourselves, to free our bodies in the face of patriarchy. In a society that sensationalizes violence against us. And seeks to marginalize, crucify, and shame us. Our existence is revolutionary. Our lovemaking is an act of resistance. We belong to ourselves and God.
Kenrya: “Untitled (Up In Harlem),” by Alena Singleton. I married u while making love to u, on a bare mattress, on a concrete floor, one sweaty night up in Harlem. I pledged my vows onto your thighs. The arch of your back quietly replied, “I do.”
Kenrya: “Hissing Fanon and Fuck You” by Arianne V. Benford. Fingertips raking trenches cross where my wings hide. Hissing Fanon and fuck you in the hollows of a spine curved as tempest. Tying your rings in my locks for safe keeping, because my skin weeps for you in eighty plus degrees. Now I know you know better. You know better than to call the fluttering in my thigh slight, the shiver and kick of drunken mule reckoning with hands of bridle and brass, that pulse circles and fireside two step. Conversation gurgling forth a brook from this throat ajar. Like thunder fracturing a 4:00 a.m. sky, there is nothing slight here. The way we bite and push, shove and suck, and stain the hardwood floor. Your hips above the face bowl bracing your left foot against the bathroom wall. The way our lips room temperature spread. Nothing slight when that stare carves up my ass for later, like enemies in honor, and honor in love, tangenting arguments in a succinct prayer, eyes open, eyes closed, claws out.
Kenrya: “Whole, and Nothing But” by Arisa White. My body feels true against your body. I swear, the truth. This sentence found an end. Start meets beginning—chest to chest, I swear. True as the dusk we love, my lifelines deep in the kink and kitchen of your hair. I got your cornrows, you got me by the breasts. Between our teeth, we need no standing translation.
Erica: Okay, y'all, so welcome back. Thank you, Kenrya, for your lovely rendition of the poetries. Did I say the-
Kenrya: The poetries.
Erica: The poems.
Kenrya: The poetries.
Erica: The poetries. Thank you so much. Okay, so we'll just jump right in to each one of them. Just a little bit about the anthology that we read. It's called Sinister Wisdom. They're a lesbian literary art journal. They release I want to say quarterly issues.
Kenrya: Yeah, I do believe so.
Erica: Because the one that we read from is Winter 2018, so they release quarterly issues of lesbian poetry.
Kenrya: Other things too. There's the Pat Parker collection that we read from last season was published by Sinister Wisdom too.
Erica: Yes, and also just in the journal, they also include stuff like photographs and art and that kind of thing. It's more than just poetry.
Kenrya: It's a pretty robust collection.
Erica: A robust collection. Good way to put it, Killa. The first poem that you read was “Questioning.” I think we've touched on this a little bit this season. They talk about how you ... Vanesa Evers wrote this article. Gosh, what's wrong with me? Vanesa Evers wrote this poem. To me the biggest thing that I took away from this is who are you in a relationship versus who people think you are. Like I said, we talked about this a little bit this season so far. One of the lines that stood out was how she ends it, "Should I tell my mother I'm the aggressive lesbian she warned me about?" It's interesting how you play, not that you play roles, but you have roles within your relationship that are intimate to the two of you and not necessarily what's projected on the outside or what people may think-
Kenrya: That's interesting.
Erica: ... or what people may know, because I think about just me as a person. I'm a very dominant force.
Kenrya: Yes, you are.
Erica: I'm a lot of person. I'm a dominant person. I find that I tend to take a more submissive backseat role in relationships, and I enjoy that. Where I fucked up is taking a submissive backseat role to motherfuckers that didn't deserve-
Kenrya: Don't know how to lead.
Erica: Yeah, exactly. Actually, I'm fine with that, I'm cool with it for the right person. Thank God for discernment now that I'm able to discern.
Erica: I think people see me and see my dynamic and relationships and think, "Oh, this bitch is running all the shots," where really it's like, eh, I don't mind running shots, but I also would love to have a nigga be the one riding.
Kenrya: Be the shot caller.
Erica: Exactly. Exactly. You know what? As I said that, it makes me think, you know how you hear women say, shit, I said this, birds said, "I'm a strong woman. I need a strong man to control me." Slow down, buckaroo!
Kenrya: Yeah, I feel like I've definitely heard you say that before.
Kenrya: I do believe I've heard you say that before, in your 20s.
Erica: Exactly. It's not even not necessarily that. It's not that, because you don't need ... I'm not like some fucking ape or donkey that needs to be controlled.
Kenrya: That's good.
Erica: We've said this before. I need to trust that you are going to lead us. I've found myself putting my trust in niggas that didn't quite need that, that didn't deserve that blind trust. Does that make sense?
Kenrya: It does make sense. I've been there.
Erica: You smell what I'm dropping?
Kenrya: I do. I really hate that analogy.
Erica: I know. It's grody.
Kenrya: I just see a horse pooping in the road.
Erica: Whatever, because I was just talking about a donkey.
Kenrya: Yes, that's what did it, the combination of the things.
Erica: The combination of the two. I definitely think about that, and then I think about relationships that I see and you're like, "Oh, he must be running the show," when maybe not. Maybe not quite.
Kenrya: It just really brings us back to this idea that we never really know what's going on in folks' relationships. We were just talking about this.
Erica: Just said that.
Kenrya: First of all, people put the version of their relationships in public that they want to, which is why anytime I see somebody say anything about goals about some shit they see on social media, I'll be like, "Oh baby, no."
Erica: I saw this meme on, it was somewhere, probably on my For You page or something, and it had a picture of Will and Jada, and they were cackling like, "Ha ha ha!" It was like, "Oh, and you all said we was goals." I'm like, "Exactly."
Kenrya: You never know how messy somebody's shit is on the inside.
Erica: I remember I had this person I worked with, and they were a fucking mess at work, just difficult. My other coworkers and I would sit around talking. We'd be like, "Oh, this nigga must not run shit at home, because he come here and is just a jerk, and there's no way in the world he do this shit at home and still with somebody." Years later he got divorced, and I talked to his partner. She was like, "Oh."
Kenrya: I know who you talking about.
Erica: "There's a reason that we got divorced." That shit was-
Kenrya: He tried that same shit at home.
Erica: Exactly. Exactly. It definitely makes me just ... This was an example of that. Then just the way that Vanessa talks about her mother explaining lesbians are aggressive, this is what lesbians do.
Kenrya: It brings us to those stereotypes, right?
Erica: Mm-hmm (affirmative). It reminds of, have I said this on the show, about how my granny was telling me, talking to me and my sister, and she said, "I know why them Black men like going with them white women." Me and my sister was like, "Why?" She said, "Because they let them, them white women's put they mouths on them Black men's penis. Ain't no self-respecting Black woman going to put her mouth on a man's penis."
Kenrya: Were you all already sucking dick at this point?
Erica: This was maybe five years ago, five to 10 years ago.
Kenrya: You'd sucked lots of dicks at that point.
Erica: Me and my sister looked at her and was like, "Oh my God, granny. Never. Thank goodness I'm with a Black man that don't believe in that kind of stuff. Pass me a water."
Kenrya: You nasty.
Erica: I know. It's another one of those situations, where you're like, "Aw. Poor thing." Now my granny's an ancestor, and she'd probably be like, "Oh, Jesus, the things that I missed."
Kenrya: The things that she sees, because I believe that our ancestors be hanging out, boy. They see more than we think they do.
Erica: Did we talk to our intuitive about that? I think I asked her or I saw her say somewhere, "Do they watch me when I'm rubbing one out?" She was like, "It's like they just close the door, like, 'Okay, we don't need to see that.'"
Kenrya: I remember once I was seeing our intuitive. This is right around when I was getting ready to ... I had already left my now ex-husband. She was communing with my grandmother. She was like, "Your grandmother funny as shit." I was like, "Yeah, she was." She was like, "She just said you about to have all kinds of nasty sex and she's so excited for you." I was like, "Thanks, grandma."
Erica: "Thanks, grandma."
Kenrya: She's very invested in the fact that I was going to have an amazing sex life, and I appreciate it.
Erica: I love that about our intuitive. One time she was like, "Do you see this card? It's a big eggplant, all this explosive stuff. He got a big dick and he's juicy." I was like, "Thank you. Thank you. That is very good to know." That's all I got for that one. You got anything to add about that one?
Kenrya: No. The lovely thing is that we're actually going to have Vanesa on the show next week, and so we get to dive even deeper into that poem with them, so it'll be great.
Erica: I know. That's why I'm trying not to do ...
Kenrya: Do too much there.
Erica: Say too much. On to another Vanesa poem, we read “Non/fiction.” This one's interesting, because she's using this poem to explore things that are roleplay, in a good way. I think we talked very early on in this show about roleplay and how I don't do costumes. "I'm a robot dinosaur." In this one she says, "I'll call you Daddy, even though neither of us liked ours, but you feel so good in my mouth." It's interesting how we use roleplay to explore some-
Kenrya: Work through our-
Erica: What'd you say?
Kenrya: I was going to say explore, but also to work through our shit.
Erica: Maybe we'll dig a little deeper into that, because I have been reading articles about how people use BDSM to work through trauma. I find that very interesting that they use some of the same things that were used against them to strengthen them.
Erica: Put a pin in that. We'll come back to that, because I don't necessarily feel like I am the one qualified to lead that discussion, but I think it's a good discussion worth having.
Kenrya: I love that.
Erica: Also, what I like about the end of this poem is how when you're using a strap, you get into it, and so they're like, "Look, stay down there until you cum," like you're using the strap to cum. It's like, "Wanting me to believe something slid down my throat, but that's okay, because I never liked that part anyway."
Kenrya: It's a very honest poem.
Erica: It's very honest, but it's also just really cool how they are aware that they're role-playing but feel so into it. I was dating this would guy, and he would let me peg him occasionally.
Erica: Damn. You was like, "Hm. Yeah."
Kenrya: I was just thinking I hadn't heard about this, and this is exciting. It feels like some kind of a fucking unicorn. I'm assuming this was a Black man that would actually let you-
Erica: It's a Black man. I'll tell you who it is when we get off of this because-
Kenrya: That's fucking dope.
Erica: Your mind will be blown at exactly who it is.
Kenrya: Oh, because I got an idea who I think it is.
Erica: Your mind will be blown.
Kenrya: I love it.
Erica: I loved it because I did it, but he would always be like, "Oh, I'm only letting you do this because you like to, you like this power." I'm like-
Kenrya: "Okay, nigga."
Erica: ... "Nigga, don't nobody just spread they booty cheeks because somebody else like it. You got to-"
Kenrya: To be clear, it feels good.
Erica: It does!
Kenrya: Stop acting like this shit don't feel good, like you don't got a whole organ that's right there that really, really loves this feeling.
Erica: That was my thing. I was cool with it. I was cool with it and I did it, because it was like, "Okay. All right. Let me do it. Wink. I like to do it," but it was just like, "Bruh, be real with yourself, because once you're real with yourself about that, then ... " Because we'd be doing it and he'd be like, "Don't you want to strap me?" I'd be like-
Kenrya: "Yeah, nigga."
Erica: ... "Yeah, okay." Yes, I did, but it was just like-
Kenrya: Yeah, he wanted it to be like it was your idea, not his all the time.
Erica: The thing is-
Kenrya: Just say what you want, bruh.
Erica: Niggas so dumb that they even ... He swore, he put it in my head, and it's like, "No, nigga. I like it, but you ain't ... " Anyway. The particular person that it was, they just made it seem like, "Oh, I care about you so much, I'm going to let you do it."
Kenrya: Did that take any of the shine off of it? Did it make it less fun because they weren't really standing grounded in the fact that this brought them pleasure?
Erica: Yes. Thinking about it now, yes, definitely, because for me I find that sex is fun when we're all in, when we just-
Kenrya: Everybody's enthusiastic.
Erica: Exactly. He was enthusiastic. He was trying to be like, "Aw. No, no! Okay, here."
Kenrya: He was being demure. Demure, but also it feels like, I don't know, I'm searching for a word. It feels to me, and tell me if this is what it felt like to you, almost on a continuum of a pity fuck, like, "Sure, if this is what you want, I'll do this." I want you to be ecstatic about what the fuck we're about to do. I don't want you to do it or make it seem like you're doing it just because it's something that I want you to do. I want you to do it because you're in and this is what you want to do at every step of the way.
Erica: Yes and no. Yes, I feel you on that, but it was clear to me once I got back there that he was-
Kenrya: You ain't stupid.
Erica: I think had I allowed the relationship to go further, I feel like I could've gotten that out of him. I ain't nobody's fucking counselor or therapist. I will be for the right person. I'm willing to explore those things with the right person.
Kenrya: He wasn't worth the investment.
Erica: It wasn't worth the investment, like, "All right. Now I'm going to open you up a little bit. Maybe the right person you'll find and you all can do this for real for real." It was definitely an interesting situation. I actually enjoyed it and loved the power and the roleplay that came from it, because even though I wasn't cumming from a dick, a plasdick, I still came from a plasdick. That was a good one.
Kenrya: Did it teach you anything about yourself and what you like?
Erica: I think it taught me that I like a nigga that's going to be honest about what he wants, because again, I don't want to feel like I'm having to ... You know how some niggas be like, "I don't want it if it's that easy," like the good reverend Tupac?
Kenrya: Uh-huh (affirmative).
Erica: I do want it if it's easy. That's my shit. Kenrya just did a body roll. The thing is, I do want it if it's that easy. I want us to all be clear about what the fuck we want and do it. I want us to be like, "Do you want to do it? Fuck yeah! Let's. Come on. I got the lube," pull out my favorite one, that kind of thing. I think that's what it taught me. I've always believed not to judge a book by its cover, but again, some niggas surprise you.
Kenrya: That they do.
Erica: That they do. On to the next. (singing) We read “Black Moon.” I loved this one. I love this one because it's a manifesto. I love the fact that they say, "Our existence is revolutionary. Our lovemaking is an act of resistance." I want to talk about this, but I don't really understand the situation enough. If I fuck this up, my bad. There's this rapper Tobin something. I feel horrible, because I actually really like him. It's the guy that did Arrest the Cops That Killed Breonna Taylor or the, you're not on the internet enough, “Try Jesus not me, Because I got these hands."
Kenrya: I watched that video.
Erica: That guy. It's him, I think it's his wife, and they got a kid, and the kid just be in the background like, "Wah!" Then they have a producer. I don't want to talk about it, because somebody's listening like, "No!" because I only catch them in passing on Instagram. I actually committed to following them today. I know we just talked about how you can't judge a book by its cover, you don't really know all of everything in a relationship, but that's what they feel like to me. They feel like this poem, where they just Black as fuck, they be in their Easter colors in a monochrome room. Is it monochrome?
Kenrya: Mm-hmm (affirmative), all one color.
Erica: In a monochrome room just talking about being Black and loving each other and kissing on fat babies. It is just the best thing on earth. I think he's a gospel artist or a gospel rapper. Maybe not a gospel rapper, but he ain't one of them, "Fuck a bitch in the pussy until she cum 10 times," kind of gal, so I feel bad saying this, but I'd love to see a sex tape, a consensual sex tape, because he's just big and Black and got gold teeth and it's just sexy. Am I being problematic?
Erica: You're looking at me. Kenrya's giving me this look.
Kenrya: I'm just listening! I'm just listening.
Erica: She has this look that she gives me when I'm being problematic, and I wasn't sure if that was the look that you were giving me.
Kenrya: No, I'm literally just ...
Erica: I would love to see them making love together, because in my mind, granted “Black Moon” is about to be lesbian and fearless, but nonetheless, I still feel like to be Black and fearless. It's just the fact that we choose to love each other openly, out loud, and proudly, is a really big fucking deal, especially in a time where niggas trying to kill us.
Kenrya: All the time.
Erica: Also, not to take away from the actual poem, which is about lesbians loving each other out loud, again, in this time where queer people are just getting fucking dogged, not only by-
Kenrya: Especially Black queer people.
Erica: I was about to say Black queer people are not only getting dogged by straights, but by the same motherfuckers that they are help advancing the fight for. Why I want to call it a article? This poem really, really, I fucking loved it. I loved it, loved it, loved it.
Kenrya: By the time I got to, "We belong to ourselves and God," I was just fully taken.
Erica: Yes. It just feels good. It feels-
Kenrya: It's like the poetic equivalent of “Fuck Them Other Niggas.”
Erica: Yes! Which I listened to this morning.
Kenrya: We were dancing to it this weekend.
Erica: We were?
Kenrya: You were drunk.
Erica: We all were.
Kenrya: You were playing the music, bitch.
Erica: I was?
Kenrya: I was the only sober person.
Erica: Yes, you were playing the music. I'll have to go back and look at pictures.
Kenrya: Oh my God.
Erica: It was definitely a wild one. I will say that.
Kenrya: We had a fun day. A fun, safe day in the midst of all of this.
Erica: In the midst of all of this.
Kenrya: COVID shit.
Erica: Which again, we're in a place right now, I feel like we need “Black Moon” cast projected on the side of a building or something right now, because this is a poetic “Fuck Them Other Niggas.” It's beautiful. It's strong. This is who I am. This is what the fuck we're doing. I can't get enough of it. I'm about to fuck up this woman's name. Akinfe Fatou.
Erica: I know I can say Fatou. I can't say the first, Akinfe. I'm so sorry, hon. Good Midwestern tongue. Mark that on your bingo cards.
Kenrya: We need to really make bingo cards.
Erica: We are going to. Watch out for that in Season Four.
Kenrya: The only other thing I really want to say about “Black Moon” that I love is it starts and she says she's studying her partner and that her partner is showing her and embodying what it means to be Black, what it means to be lesbian, what it means to be proud, what it means to be free. I love the idea of being partnered with someone who helps you to be more of yourself and that helps to bring you to that place. That's why I love, by the time that she says, it goes from her studying her partner to her saying that our lovemaking is an act of resistance, so now you're not two separate entities, it's about what you do together. It's about the fact that you belong to yourselves and to God, that you have now come together. She's shown you what this means. She's modeled this for you, and now you're there in that same space together. I love that.
Erica: I believe that each relationship, good or bad, teaches you something. Do you believe that?
Kenrya: I do believe that. I'm thinking about my shittiest relationships and the fact that I learned something. Don't mean I want to do it again, but I did learn something.
Erica: Now that I am better at picking partners and relationships, I think I look forward to learning more about, okay, so I think I know everything there is to know about me, but what is there new to learn? What will this uncover, in a good healthy way, as opposed to, I don't want to have to hit rock bottom to learn X, Y and Z anymore. Just let me learn it from a game-
Kenrya: I told you.
Erica: ... or we-
Kenrya: An honest conversation.
Erica: Exactly. Some good questions. “Untitled (Up In Harlem).” Reading it reminded me of this relationship I had in college, only because it says, "I married you while making love to you on a bare mattress on a concrete floor."
Kenrya: Bitch, I almost spit out my tea.
Erica: I didn't marry a nigga, but I definitely had a relationship in college where we slept on an air mattress. I would leave a real dorm room to go sleep on a fucking air mattress.
Kenrya: Bitch, you was wiling.
Erica: I was in college and in love and I had a good back. Now I'd be like, "Mm-mm (negative)." I remember the night my ex-husband and I bought our house, and I was just so hype to ... I was like, "We bought this house. We're going to spend the night in it." I brought the air mattress that we had, and we slept in this empty ass house on an air mattress. I remember I woke up at 2:00 in the morning and this nigga was gone. I said, "Where the fuck is he?" I look outside and this nigga is in the car, with the AC on, knocked out. He was like, "I tried waking you up. I knew you'd come out here soon."
Erica: That shit don't work when you hit a certain age. At the time it was sexy. Not sexy, but it was just like, "Aw, humble beginnings."
Kenrya: "We're together."
Erica: "We'll write these stories later in life when we're married and kids about how we used to, 'Oh, I used to go to your daddy house and sleep on the air mattress on the floor.'" Nigga, no. Not at all. I will tell all my babies, "You deserve so much more."
Kenrya: You do.
Erica: You deserve so much more.
Kenrya: However, in this poem, the feeling that I got from it was like, yeah, it was probably not the ideal situation, but I was so into you and so wanting you in that moment, that even on a fucking concrete floor-
Erica: Sweaty night.
Kenrya: ... I still found my way to you.
Erica: Yes. It's beautiful. It's beautiful. It's sexy. I could feel this poem. Again, this poem, I'm holding it up, this poem is a romanticized version of what I thought the struggle was in college.
Erica: Not to look badly on this poem. I don't want to make it seem like-
Kenrya: It's a beautiful poem.
Erica: It's a beautiful poem. I just think that young girls, not all girls, but some girls get caught up in, "The struggle is going to bond us together and this is going to be beautiful, and we'll look back on it." No, honey. Even that particular guy was a sweetheart, and it was just circumstances, whatever, but no, honey.
Kenrya: Have you ever made any proclamations while having sex, said things for the first time?
Erica: Bitch! I can't find it. I have a text message. This dude that I used to fuck, I think I showed it to you, that was like, "You told me you loved me." I was like, "Oh, I was dick drunk. My bad." Don't trust me. If I was a nigga, I'd probably done bought a million bitches cars, because, "Can I have a car?" "Yep, whatever you want."
Kenrya: "Just keep sucking that dick."
Erica: "I said that? My bad." I try not to get too crazy, but I definitely get dick drunk, pussy drunk, gooch drunk. I learned about gooch and now I keep talking about it. I don't even play with the gooch too often. I have. What about you? You seem like you're just too levelheaded to do that.
Kenrya: Yeah, I've never said anything in the heat of the moment that I couldn't take back.
Erica: I'm trash. Also I'm a gemini, so I might've actually truly, truly felt it right then.
Kenrya: In that moment.
Erica: It's just ...
Kenrya: I'm always thinking about the consequences and the fallout of shit, so nah, son, I ain't never.
Erica: See, that's the thing. When I'm in it and it's good, I'm in it. "Erica, what's your name?" "I don't know!"
Kenrya: I've had people say things to me in the middle that they probably did not mean to say, but nah, because I try not to take those things too seriously.
Erica: I probably need to have a disclaimer written on my back, like, "If you are here, anything that's said at this point, just ignore it." I get dick drunk, and it is over for me.
Kenrya: The next poem, which I think is pronounced “Hissing Fanon and Fuck You,” but you just told me I was probably wrong.
Erica: You all know I can't fucking pronounce shit. I don't know why she thinks that. Anyway, continue.
Kenrya: This poem was interesting to me, because what I got from it is that it is these two people who are lovers, but also they hate each other's fucking guts.
Kenrya: When they come together, it's like an explosion. It's like thunder, it says. There's a conversion that's happening. Shit, "Shove and suck, and stain the hardwood floor." So much of this felt violent in some ways. That's not a bad thing if that's what you like. I speak from experience. It was this idea that as much as they hate each other is the same amount that they can't keep their hands off of each other, and the fact that when they do come together, it is an explosion and they just can't help themselves. Have you ever found yourself fucking somebody who outside of fucking you really can't stand?
Erica: I think we talked about that. I don't think so. Maybe. What'd I say? Go back. Run that tape back. I can't remember if I did or not. Shit, that was last episode.
Kenrya: Was it?
Kenrya: I don't think so.
Erica: Shit. Anyway.
Kenrya: Also, a bitch is old and we recorded this a while ago.
Erica: I don't think so, only because I want to feel like you really like me. I don't like that, "He's mean to me so he likes me," shit.
Kenrya: Yes, that's what we're talking about, teaching our kids that a nigga shouldn't be mean to you if he likes you.
Erica: I don't think I do that, but maybe-
Kenrya: Have you ever found yourself going back to have sex with someone who you broke up with who you don't like? I hear that a lot, where people break up but they're still having sex, and I've never actually done that before. That feels along the same lines, I guess, depending on how you all broke up.
Erica: No. Did I? I don't think so. You know these pussy miles more than me, so maybe.
Kenrya: No one that's coming to mind.
Erica: I definitely remember breaking up with someone and then getting drunk and calling them and then we got back together and was doing it, but none of the, because I don't need that toxic shit. If we broke up, we broke up for a reason. That was the only time I doubled back to somebody. I do have people that I've had very intense sex with, so it was never sweet fucking, it was never slow stroking. It was put the nigga in a headlock and riding him until he turn blue in the fact, that kind of shit.
Kenrya: Was that emblematic of the rest of you all's relationship or was it only like that when you were having sex?
Erica: Actually, it was very much the opposite. It was very sweet and kind and doting and all of that, but then once we got to doing the do, it was just some like, "Is that a bruise?" type shit, which to me was a turn on, because it was like, "You were so ... " It was a turn on, because-
Kenrya: It's like in the movie when they say the name of the movie in the dialog.
Erica: It was a turn on, because it was so opposite of who he was as a person and as a lover.
Kenrya: It was unexpected.
Erica: Yeah. The first time it happened, I was like, "Oh, shit." It was very different. I think that's what made it even that much hotter, because he was one of them niggas that would have taken off his jacket and put it over a puddle if I needed him to, that kind of shit.
Kenrya: I never understood that. I'm like, "Don't it just all get wet?"
Erica: Don't you just step in it? Yeah.
Kenrya: Yeah, but anyway.
Erica: It makes sense in cartoons. “Whole and Nothing But.” I think that this one, one of the biggest things that I got from this, and you brought this up, is that intimacy brings the truth between two people. I say this all the time. Once you done had your face in somebody's booty, certain walls are broken down. That's not always the case, which I find a bit problematic anyway, because it's like, "We doing something this close."
Kenrya: I think there's a lot of situations in which you can do something that close and then walk away.
Erica: You know what? I totally agree. I am one that always says, "Hey, sex and intimacy are two different things." In sex, it feels like their lovemaking, their sex is just so icky and sticky and raw and passionate that anything that could be between them is now, those walls have come down and they are now just ... Two becomes one.
Kenrya: In an extra Black way.
Kenrya: In a really extra Black way.
Erica: I was just about to say, "I got your cornrows. You got me by the breast."
Kenrya: Yeah, and, "My lifelines deep in the kink and kitchen of your hair." That ain't nothing but two Black women.
Erica: Two niggas, loving on one another and sexing on one another. It also feels like you don't know what ... Who sings that song, and it's like, "I don't know where the ending begins." India.Arie.
Kenrya: Brown Skin. That's one of my favorite lines in that song, "I can't tell where yours ends and I begin." Oof. Yes.
Erica: You all got me ready to go.
Kenrya: I feel that way often, because my partner and I are about the same color. I be like, "Yeah, that's true, I can't tell."
Erica: You all got me ready to go pat this puss. This was just Black as fuck and beautiful and we're just two just folks all stuck in with one another and in love. I loved it.
Kenrya: I love this repeating refrain of the, "I swear." It feels like such a ... First of all, when we were a kid, we weren't really allowed to say, "I swear," but if you said it, you meant that shit, like, "I swear!"
Erica: My father died when I was younger, when I was 10, so like, "Put that on daddy grave." You put that on daddy grave, then-
Kenrya: You meant that shit.
Erica: We mean business. "You put it on your granny!" That kind of shit.
Kenrya: Yes. That popping up that, "I swear, the truth, chest to chest, I swear," it just felt so uniquely us.
Erica: I think that's so true with this entire, all the poems, all the poetries that we read in today's episode. It's all so beautiful and so Black. The words, the fabric of it just feels ... I'm rubbing my fingers like I'm rubbing a slick do-rag.
Kenrya: The silkiest of the silks.
Erica: The silkiest of the silks. This just feels good and Black in the sense of everything. There are a million little bits that just wouldn't nobody else understand, but you understand it and feel it and it just feels Black. These have been amazing poems. We had a lot more that we liked, but we had to settle on only a few.
Kenrya: We had to pick a few. Thank you to all of the poets that we featured, because they all gave us permission and said, "Hey, yeah."
Erica: Thank you to our good homies at Sinister Wisdom, who I think this is the second time we've worked with them.
Kenrya: Always a pleasure.
Erica: Always a pleasure, always hooking us up with dope ass works. You all are the best. That wraps up this part of the episode. We will go on to, (singing), What's Turning Us On. What's turning me on this week is Sliquid. It is a type of lube. It comes in a bunch of different, I don't want to say flavors, because they don't taste, but-
Erica: Varieties. They come in a bunch-
Erica: A bunch of different blends. Sliquid is this really cool lube. It's a silicone-based lube, which means your body doesn't absorb it, which means a little bit goes a long way, and it stays. Only thing that I would not do is use that shit with your silicone toys, because it'll break it down.
Kenrya: It can make it sticky.
Erica: I love this fucking lube.
Kenrya: You put me on to this one.
Kenrya: You put me on to that one too.
Erica: Two things. One, they also sell them in little bitty packets, which are great for your hoe bag, so you don't have to tote a whole bag, a whole jar of lube, a whole bottle of lube with you. You can just dink dink dink dink dink. Second, a sex educator put me on to this. I think I might've mentioned it. Buy those little pumps, those little screw pumps, and put them in the top of your lube, so you don't have to-
Kenrya: That's way easier.
Erica: You literally just, and go at it.
Kenrya: I'm so sad that you all don't get to see all the hand movements.
Erica: Next season. Next season.
Kenrya: So many hand movements.
Erica: I love it. I think it's the best. We're going to include a link to it in the show notes.
Kenrya: In the What's Turning Us On page on our website.
Erica: If you're looking for just a good lube for everyday types of stuff, use this, or you could use it with your silicone toys, just got to put a condom over it. Use it. It's great. I love it. It's turning me on.
Kenrya: Love that.
Erica: That's all I got.
Kenrya: That's what up.
Erica: That was an easy one. This was an easy one.
Kenrya: Lube sells itself.
Erica: With that said, this was a great episode. You got anything else for us, any announcements?
Erica: Buy Kenrya's book.
Kenrya: Yep. I got another book out. Thanks, boo. It's called “Anti-Racism: Powerful Voices Inspiring Ideas.” It's available everywhere, but I always recommend that you buy it at a Black bookseller. Let's keep our money circulating our community.
Erica: We will include links in the show notes.
Kenrya: It's on our Bookshop page as well.
Erica: I'm sorry, that's what I meant. We'll include it on our Bookshop page. With that, this is Erica. Two hoes, making it clap. I can't do this on my own.
Kenrya: This is Kenrya, two hoes.
Kenrya: You said, "This is Erica."
Erica: No, I said, "This is Erica and Kenrya."
Kenrya: Mm-mm (negative).
Erica: My bad.
Kenrya: Making it clap!
Erica: With that said, this is Erica and Kenrya.
Kenrya: Two hoes.
Erica: Making it clap.
Kenrya: Making it clap. Whatever. One day. Maybe.
Erica: This episode was produced by us, Erica and Kenrya, and edited by B'Lystic. The theme music is from Brazy. Now you can support The Turn On and get off. Subscribe to the show on your favorite podcast app, then drop us a five-star review, and you'll be entered to win something that's turning us on. Post your review and email a screenshot to us at TheTurnOnPodcast@gmail.com to enter. Our Patreon page is also live. Become a supporter today and access lots of goodies, including two-for-one raffle entries. Don't forget to send us your book recommendations and sex-and-related questions. Follow us on Twitter @TheTurnOnPod and Instagram @TheTurnOnPodcast. You can find links to books, merch, transcripts, guest info and other fun stuff at TheTurnOnPodcast.com. Thanks for listening, and we'll see you soon. Holla!
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In this episode of The Turn On, Erica and Kenrya read “Rise of the Rain Queen” by Fiona Zedde and talk about the role family plays in romantic relationships and dating folks who are too old for us. Plus, they announce the first selection in The Turn On Book Club!
The Turn On participates in affiliate programs, which provide a small commission when you purchase products via links on this site. This costs you nothing, but helps support the show. Click here for more information.
Kenrya: Come here. Get off.
Erica: Welcome to the second episode of season three.
Kenrya: Ayyeeeeee! I wish I could do air horns. I'm not good at it.
Erica: Bah bah bah! It's because we're from the Midwest and not Jamaica. That is why we don't-
Kenrya: Maybe that's why. We need a Midwestern sound. I don't know what that would be. What? It's about to be ignorant. (singing).
Erica: Smoking on hay...
Kenrya: Hay, in the middle of the barn! Y’all missed the titty shimmy.
Erica: They're more of a side to side until I get a little movement in them.
Kenrya: It was still a shimmy.
Kenrya: I like it.
Erica: Thanks, boo. We'll have some sort of Midwest version of an air horn, trust and believe. Welcome to the second episode of season three of The Turn On. We are just going to jump right in it. Today we are reading “Rise of the Rain Queen.”
Kenrya: Sorry. You know I can never resist.
Erica: You know what? You're special, because the office is special, so why not? This week we're reading “Rise of the Rain Queen” by Fiona Zedde, which was written in 2016. Sit back, relax, get your wine, get your weed, get your whatever you need, and enjoy.
Kenrya: Let's do it.
Kenrya: “Rise of the Rain Queen,” by Fiona Zedde.
Kenrya: “Duni, don't pretend that when you said those things to me you didn't mean for me to change and become the woman you want.” Ny balanced her hands on her thighs, hoping and praying that she was right. In her eyes, Duni had practically dared her to grow up. “So tell me, am I now the woman you want?” She felt Duni close to her, the heat of her body just a touch away. Her breath smelled of a recent dinner and mint leaves. “Do you want me?”
Kenrya: A sigh left Duni's lips, “I ....” She drew back and took her breath, her lips, and her heat with her. Ny straightened her spine against the disappointment. At least her father was proud of her now. At least she knew her mother than she had before. At least ... Duni kissed her. Ny gasped and drew in the taste of Duni into her mouth. Mint and sweetness and the press of her soft lips. Ny's heart thudded in her chest and her lashes fluttered with surprise. Then she realized what was happening. Duni was actually kissing her. Ny quivered and kissed back. She and Duni crashed together, mouths pressing firmly, hands grasping in heated intent. Ny tingled every place they touched.
Kenrya: Her head spun with the reality of what was happening, her fantasies no longer confined to her sleeping mat, but made real under moonlight with the quiet rushing of the river nearby. Emboldened, she touched even more than she had in her dreams, her fingers slipping under the thin kanga to skate over Duni's waist beads, her warm skin. Duni shuddered and pulled back with a moan. She licked her lips, took a moment to regain her breath. Her eyes dipped down. “This is dangerous for me.”
Kenrya: Yes, it would be dangerous if Duni's husband found out, but they would be discreet. They would only touch when they were alone. They would only speak of their intimacies to each other. “We need to be careful,” Ny said. It didn't even cross her mind to give up what she'd just found with Duni. “Yes.” Duni's tongue appeared to wet her lips and Ny stopped thinking. She leaned in again to press a kiss back to Duni's mouth, entranced by the softness of it, the plump dampness like ripe fruit. The faint taste of oil and honey berries lingered on those soft lips. Had Duni worn the oil for her?
Kenrya: It excited her, the thought that Duni had enticed her to the river not just to talk, but to kiss, like this. Ny licked the enticing flavor on Duni's mouth, the sweetness of the berries and the much more delicious taste of her mouth's natural essence. She was like a fruit Ny had only hoped of tasting, always hanging high on the vine and out of reach, and now here she was, practically in Ny's lap. She groaned and pressed closer. Duni drew back, smiling. She curved her palm around Ny's cheek. “Like this.”
Kenrya: She kissed Ny again, lips pressing as delicately as flower petals, leaving Ny slightly dizzy, a hunt in the forest that pushed her body to the very limit. The feel of her was intoxicating and weakening, strange in a way she'd never considered. She'd been interested in kissing girls before, but too nervous to try. Nervous in a way she hadn't been bout jumping from cliffs or diving into the river. Duni's lips parted, her tongue gently breaking the seam of Ny's mouth and her thoughts flew away, a flock of wild birds.
Kenrya: Heat pooled in her belly with each stroke of Duni's tongue. A shiver rippled through her body. It felt dangerous, this kind of kissing, her heartbeat speeding up too fast to be safe, her breath stolen, her palms wet, but she didn't want to stop. Duni taught her everything she needed to know. The kiss could be a greeting, an apology, an unmaking. Duni's tongue slid against Ny's, firm and slick. Her hands gripped her waist, sinking into soft flesh. Her thoughts were gone. Everything was only sensation, wet agitation between her legs, a sound like pain from her throat, or was it from Duni? Soft noises, squirming against Ny on the rock, their chests pressed together, nipples rubbing, aching. Ny pulled away with a gasp, desperately needing to breathe.
Kenrya: Duni's breath puffed against her lips. “Are y’all right?” Ny shook her head. “My heart is beating in my chest. It feels like I'm going to die.” “Die?” “Yes. No. I can't explain it properly. It feels good.” Her hands drifted down to Duni's hips. “You feel good.” She dipped her hand into the curve of Duni's neck, smelled her, that soft place where neck met shoulder, the scent of her hair, of wood fires and honey flower oil. Ny licked her throat and Duni shivered against her. “I knew you'd be a fast learner.”
Kenrya: Ny drew back. “How do you know I haven't done this before?” Duni laughed, trailed a hand down Ny's bare back. “There are no secrets in this village, Nyandoro.” She flicked a thumb across Ny's lower lip. “Besides, your touch feels too tentative for you to be anything but untouched, and I'm surprised. I thought you, you would've had many offers.” “I've had offers, but there's never been anyone I wanted, no one but you.” “You humble me.” “Does that mean I can taste you now?” She dropped her gaze to Duni's hips so there was no mistaking her meaning. Duni smothered her laughter in Ny's shoulder. “Very fast learner, and eager too.” She lifted her head, eyes still shining mirth. “Not here. Tonight.” “Then where? I...”
Kenrya: Was there some way she could tell Duni that she ached? Her nipples hurt, but the pain was sweet. Between her legs was slippery and an even deeper ache was there. She wanted to touch herself but knew it would be even better if Duni touched her. “I want to touch you and I want you to touch me.” “I know. Soon.” The humor vanished from her eyes. “Remember, we must be careful.” Ny shivered at the seriousness in her voice. The lust drained from her, common sense slowly replacing it. Duni could lose everything, she realized again. Was this worth it? “Are you sure?”
Kenrya: Duni shook her head. “No. You don't get to chase me and then change your mind when I say yes. Now I'm the one saying yes.” She leaned in to kiss Ny once again, her gaze flying to the path far up the river. “I have to go. They'll miss me if I'm away much longer.” She pulled the comb from her hair. It was the same one from the first night they met by the river. “Take this and think of me.” “I always think of you.” But she took the comb anyway and slid it into the neckline of her kanga. With another look at the path, Duni clamored down from the rock. In the dark, Ny could feel Duni's gaze on her mouth, on the slope of her shoulders. “See you soon.”
Erica: Welcome back. That was “Rise of the Rain Queen” by Fiona Zedde. Let's start with the synopsis, and then we'll go into our big announcement, or should we do our announcement and then the synopsis?
Kenrya: I don't know. It's your show, boo. What you want to do?
Erica: It's our show, but since I get the choice, quick synopsis. This book is set in the Tanganyika region of Africa.
Kenrya: In 1400?
Erica: Yeah, in 1400. Pretty much in this society, all people at the age of 19, 20, they get to pick their partner, and then they live happily ever after. In this story, Ny, who is the main character, she is pretty much one of those little scrappy, "I'm going to do whatever the fuck I want, be in typical male or typical female roles. This is what I'm going to do." She has decided that she wants to take on this woman as her partner. Problem is this woman is married, is one of the wives of this guy that has multiple wives. It's a conflict there and just greater folklore in the community.
Kenrya: That's a good way of putting it. We got to work really hard not to spoil this one.
Erica: Because this has some really big spoilers, some really big twists and turns, and so I'm trying to give you the gist of it without-
Kenrya: This is like the “Fight Club” of Black romance.
Erica: Okay. Uh-huh (affirmative). Yeah. That. Anyway, so just take our word for it. It is a really good book. We want you guys to experience that book, so we are launching, (singing) The Turn On ... We really need a budget for special effects.
Kenrya: Yeah, some sounds. I think we can make that happen.
Erica: We probably can. We are launching The Turn On Book Club. First, to get access to the book club, join our Patreon. The entry level is five bucks a month, $5 a month. Let a bitch hold $5, please.
Kenrya: That's all. It gets you into the book club.
Erica: Gets you into the book club. We'll send you guys a handwritten thank you card. We have a bunch of different levels, but the entry level is called Just the Tip.
Kenrya: I believe so, yes.
Erica: Join as a Just the Tip contributor and you get access to the book club, as well as a handwritten thank you card. The book club will be quarterly. Did we say quarterly or monthly?
Erica: The book club will be quarterly. We will discuss a book in detail that we've read on the show.
Kenrya: You get to chop it up with us about a book.
Erica: It will be one on one. Not one on one.
Erica: Small group, one, two. That's what she said.
Erica: It'll be small group with us, and we will lead the discussion around this book, “Rise of the Rain Queen.”
Kenrya: Yep, this is our first book club selection. It's so dope, y’all.
Erica: Yeah, it's a really, really good book.
Kenrya: Get your copy. Hold up.
Erica: Oh, shit.
Kenrya: Go to our website. Click through-
Kenrya: ... to our Patreon. You can also purchase your copy of the book directly from the episode page for this episode. You get your book, you get into the club, and then we'll see you online. You get to see us.
Erica: Yeah, y’all get to see us, in all of our bad bitchedness. Reow. This little excerpt that Kenrya read, it really was about the first time that Ny and her partner, or her beloved, Duni, this was the first time that they really had an opportunity to-
Kenrya: Explore each other.
Erica: ... explore each other. Ny for a while has seen Duni in the village. She been cutting eyes at her, to the point where all her family is like, "Goddamn. You going to sop her up with a biscuit." There's a lot. She got all these brothers. They're constantly teasing her about this shit. You know what I really loved about this book was that her brothers were super loving and super supportive. One of the things that stood out to both of us in this story is that choosing to pick someone of the same sex as a partner isn't a-
Kenrya: It's not a thing. It's just what people do.
Erica: ... "Oh, she's a lesbian." It's just, "I chose a woman partner." I think the only real time that it was even mentioned as a thing was when her mom was like, "Yeah, but the women in our society passed down the lineage, and so I wanted you to pick a man-"
Kenrya: Have kids.
Erica: "... so you could pass our name down." It wasn't even like a, "Why are you doing it?" It was just like a, "Damn. [crosstalk 00:16:51]."
Kenrya: Yes for matrilineal society.
Erica: Yes. I just thought it was really cute. I got the warm and fuzzies, every time Ny was talking to her brothers or her dad or her mother about-
Kenrya: Yeah, because even when they were fucking with her, it was love.
Erica: Exactly. Even when some really bad things happened and she had to make some really hard decisions, her brothers were behind her, down for her like four flat tires, which begs me to think about, to ask the question of you, Kenrya, how was your family when it came to you dating people, particularly early in your dating history? In this society, I think Ny is probably, I didn't get a number, probably 19, 20, something like that.
Kenrya: Yeah, because she's just about to reach a age where she gets to pick a partner.
Erica: She's 19, 20. This is really her first time dating and showing interest in people. I just thought it was great how supportive her family was, but still like, "Be careful, girl."
Kenrya: "Slow down."
Erica: What about you?
Kenrya: Aye aye aye. Honestly, I think there's a lot of problematic stuff around how my family was. I was raised by my dad. My mom wasn't really at all involved at that point. My father was just like, "Okay." I remember that there was this dude who I was dating, and my dad was just glad he had a car so I didn't have to borrow ours. I was 16, and this nigga was 23.
Kenrya: Yeah. Statutory like a motherfucker. Because of the way that I was set up at that time, I wasn't having sex or anything, but it was still, I shouldn't have been hanging out with that grown ass man.
Erica: What the fuck are you doing at 23 where you got interest with a 16-year-old, no matter how-
Kenrya: Chaste or whatever.
Kenrya: We might've kissed.
Erica: ... adult-like you were, because probably you were running accounting books at 16.
Kenrya: Yeah, but I looked like I was fucking 12-
Erica: 14, yeah.
Kenrya: ... with big titties. I feel like it was probably too permissive, honestly. He was pretty hands-off, but he was hands-off on a lot of stuff. I think sometimes that's the way that things can progress when you are a single parent. It can go either way. Sometimes single parents are like, "I'm involved in every moment of your life," and then sometimes it's like, "Nigga, this too much." I think my father definitely took the, "Nigga, this is too much," strategy. I definitely was hanging out, doing shit I shouldn't have been doing. I was lying and telling him I was going to the movies, and then we was walking around the fucking outdoor mall situation with niggas, collecting numbers at the mall, with one bag-
Kenrya: ... so we looked like we was doing something.
Erica: I really remember going to the mall with my girls and being like, "Oh, we got to make sure we bring a pen and a piece of paper."
Kenrya: Yeah, so you can write numbers down.
Erica: So you can write down numbers.
Kenrya: Because we had pagers, that was it, so you had to write numbers down.
Erica: I had a pager, but I might not have always had a pager, because I had to go-
Kenrya: Because she wouldn't turn it on.
Erica: ... to the place to pay on it every month.
Kenrya: Pay your bill.
Erica: If my aunt didn't take me, nigga, you was just going to have to wait a few days for your pager to get turned back on.
Kenrya: Exactly. There was too much. It was too permissive, I think.
Erica: My question is, do you think that your dad was super, trying not to tell all your business, but do you think your dad was super permissive because you were who you were? Do you think maybe had you been another kid, he might've been a little more lockdown, which would've then resulted in everybody else in the family being locked down, or was it like, "Killa was the start and she was cool so I can be cool with the rest of them."
Kenrya: No, I think that he was very often was just overwhelmed with what it meant to take care of two young women, and so sometimes things fell through the crack and he said yes to things he shouldn't have said yes to. I had a boyfriend my senior year in high school who-
Erica: That nigga in jail?
Kenrya: Yeah, who would stay over. It really started right before I went to college. I didn't realize it until partway through my freshman year, but this dude was picking fights with his parents so they would kick him out of the house, because he knew my dad would let him stay. He did that before I left to go to school, so he could spend more time. I literally didn't know that this is what was happening. I just knew that my father was too permissive and would let this dude stay in our house. Then I went away to college, and he was super clingy and would say shit like, "Oh, you sitting in class with all them college boys." I was like, "Nigga, what is you talking about?" He had his issues. Then I realized that there was a pattern, that every time I would go back to Cleveland, this nigga would get kicked out and have to stay at my house. The last time it happened was Valentine's Day of my freshman year. I had caught on to what was happening. I refused to let him come to my house. Then I broke up with him. That was the end of that, because I didn't appreciate ... I'm like, "At least if this is your strategy, talk to a bitch."
Erica: Yeah, like, "Let's plan this together, not just you plan it for this shit to happen."
Kenrya: It just felt super controlling, and it was, ultimately.
Erica: Yeah, manipulative.
Kenrya: Yeah. Too permissive, I think. What about you?
Erica: My grandmother raised me through high school, but I grew up in a house with my grandmother and my aunt. My grandmother, grandfather, aunt, and my younger sister. The way my granny's house was, there was always people there. Granny was the rule setter and the law layer downer, law down layer. You know what I'm saying. The rule was no dating until you 16. I was one of those kids that was like ... Even now my family's freaking out that I'm doing this podcast and all that. They're like, "Oh my God, this is Erica?" because I was a good kid. I fed them what they wanted to know. I fed them what they needed to see. I was smoking weed in high school. I was fucking in high school.
Kenrya: You fed into the expectations of respectability.
Erica: Exactly. It's funny because my younger sister is the complete opposite.
Kenrya: Yes, she is.
Erica: She was like-
Kenrya: "Fuck it."
Erica: What's that meme with like, "I do what I want. I do what I want." It's Lil Uzi Vert. That is my sister. That was her growing up. Actually, thinking about it now, I want to feel bad about, damn, I was the perfect kid. My family definitely tried to compare me and my sister, but my younger sister was like, "Fuck that. I refuse." That's one of the things-
Kenrya: Good for her.
Erica: ... that I really love about her, because she was like, "Fuck that." She didn't blow up my spot. They'll be like, "Can you believe?" My sister, she called me and be like, "Bitch, they get on my nerves, talk about Erica never did. They just didn't know." She just has this inner, "Fuck y’all, I'm going to do what I want. Fuck what you say," that I am so proud of in her, because I feel like because we were so close in age, it would've been easy for them to pit us against each other. I think they did, unknowingly, but my sister refused that-
Kenrya: That's awesome.
Erica: ... and was like, "Fuck that," because I had a little boyfriend. He was probably 18, 19. He was dat nigga, because he had a Cutlass that was sitting on some big ass rims. He would pick me up. We would go to his house. We'd eat Jack In A Box. We'd go and do little nasty things. My family swore up and down I was the sweetest. My little sister was like, "Bitch, I knew this dude. I saw he was everywhere. He was a little D-boy and your ass was just hopping in the car with him." All that to say, I think my family, and again, it was my grandma, so she was trying her best. I fed them the goody two shoes, "She's doing everything right." I brought home damn near straight A's. There was only so much that they could do or say. Had they dug a little deeper, they definitely could've caught me in some shit. I think my grandmother didn't know enough to dig deeper.
Kenrya: To know to look.
Erica: My aunts was just probably like, "This little fast ass. This little hot ass little girl."
Kenrya: That's interesting. I'm thinking about that. Yes, my family did think that there ... A lot of my family outside my immediate family, they still have these really deeply ingrained notions about who I am.
Erica: Who I am, and I'm like-
Kenrya: I'm like, "Nigga, hey."
Kenrya: This is not me. Because I was valedictorian and talked a good game and volunteered all over the place and all that stuff, it was like the idea of me having more than one side to me or more than one part of who I am that made up the whole was super duper foreign to them, even then. I think it still is. They still trip off the fact that I do and say the things that I do at this point.
Erica: Some of it is just part of me being who I am, but I just sold one part harder than I sold the other part. Does that make sense?
Erica: Because I don't want to make it seem like I was walking around false.
Kenrya: This is just not the part that y’all knew.
Erica: Y’all don't know this part.
Erica: It's crazy, because now here in D.C., I talk to my friends and I tell them, "Yo, I am the quiet one in my family." I'm not the like...
Kenrya: The only reason I know that's true is because I spend so much time around your family.
Erica: It's scary to think that.
Kenrya: It's true.
Erica: They're like, "Oh, Erica bougie. She don't like." No, I'm not going to ... My granny lives across the street from a church. It's like, no, I'm not going to go to the church and smoke weed. We ain't smoking weed in granny house. I'm like, "Y’all, we in a church!" At least walk three doors down to-
Kenrya: [crosstalk 00:28:21] a little bit.
Erica: ... to somebody else's house.
Kenrya: [crosstalk 00:28:23].
Erica: All that to say, my granny and grandpa were still very much old-school, so even when I went out, I would go on dates ... I couldn't date until I was 16. I think they let me go on a date. My birthday's at the end of May. They let me go on a date beginning of May, so I cut it by three weeks.
Kenrya: I don't even remember if I had a ... I don't think I had a ...
Erica: I could not date until I was 16. Ain't no nigga coming to honk the horn and you run out.
Kenrya: Oh, that's ignorant.
Erica: You better put that bitch in park, take the keys out, come in, and speak.
Kenrya: Oh, they had to come in.
Erica: Oh yeah, they had to ring the doorbell, come in and speak. My granny had to lay eyes on you. I lived in one of them neighborhoods where-
Kenrya: Everybody was laying eyes.
Erica: Everybody knew everybody on top of that. I'm sorry, we just going to go there. Every Saturday night my granny would fry fish. I don't care what's happening, what's going on, she frying fish. For prom I had to go and get dressed in the basement bathroom.
Kenrya: So you didn't smell like fish.
Erica: So I didn't smell like fried fish for prom. With that said, everybody knows that my granny would fry fish on a Saturday. If some dude coming to pick me up, he going to walk in the house, it's going to be half of my family in there like, "What's your name? Now who your mama? Did I go to school with her?" That kind of thing. They were very into it. At the same time, I remember I met this guy and I was working at a mall. We went on a date. I remember he came to pick me up. He picked me up after work. He met me at the mall. We went to Houlihan’s or something, because they had some good hot wings. We went to Houlihan’s, then I called my granny to ask her if I could stay out later. My aunt was like, "Don't let that boy take up your whole day," or, "Don't be too available for a boy." I remember little things like that that they told me.
Kenrya: Words of wisdom.
Erica: Which it makes a lot of sense now, because I am a queen of like, "I like you. Let's let this date keep going."
Kenrya: There's nothing wrong with that with a person who's worth your time.
Erica: Exactly, but nigga, we in high school. The nigga gave me some hot wings and [crosstalk 00:30:47]. I think that my aunts and my mom tried to show interest and be supportive, but not to the point where they're condoning anything too serious. When I was younger, I used to get frustrated, when I would be like, "He don't love me." Somebody, an adult, someone would always be like, "Y’all so young. This shit ain't going to mean nothing," because it would frustrate me. I try not to do that to younger people when they're going through it.
Kenrya: Because it feels very real and it is very real in the moment.
Erica: Bitch, you so young, this don't mean shit.
Kenrya: You will legit forget that nigga's name. I got whole ass niggas whose names I don't know.
Erica: Don't know, can't remember.
Kenrya: Who I was probably in a relationship with.
Kenrya: One of my sisters met somebody in Paris who said that we were boyfriend and girlfriend, and it took me 30 minutes and searching around on Facebook to figure out who the fuck she was talking about.
Erica: Oh girl.
Kenrya: I was like, "Oh, he was my boyfriend." Forgot.
Erica: Just a drop in the bucket. So young. One of the things that Ny did in the story, so Duni told Ny when they first met, "Girl, you on that little kid shit. You got your hands in everything. You doing too much. You on that little kid shit. Ain't no way we could ever be together because you on that little kid shit." Ny took that as a, "I need to act older. I need to change my ways." She went through this whole process, this whole period, where she really tried to be what she thought Duni wanted her to be. Things happened. We find out Duni's real. She said it in the excerpt we read. Duni was like, "Girl, that ain't ... Yeah, but no. I see you being not true to yourself, and that's not what I meant by that." Have you ever tried to change up who you are for a nigga?
Kenrya: Sure. I'm certain I've had. Sometimes consciously, probably a whole lot of times unconsciously. It's like when you start getting into some shit that you ain't never thought two seconds about because it's his thing, and not just on some supportive of his hobby, but really got yourself convinced that this is your shit, that kind of thing.
Erica: Standing backstage at a fucking rap concert, trying to act like you care about this-
Kenrya: Oh my God.
Erica: ... hotep ass music.
Kenrya: Do you know how many concerts I went to of roots reggae? I don't like roots reggae, bitch. It's standing room only in these clubs in New York, just standing there for legit three or four hours, trying to get drunk enough, but not so drunk that I couldn't stand up for all those hours. Lord have mercy. Terribly. Yes, I have done that. Yes. That's the minor ways. There are big ways that you can do it too. It's one of the ways that codependency robs you of yourself, when you're being the person that you either think you need to be for this person or that they're telling you that you need to be for them, and you start the lose parts of yourself because-
Erica: Giving your life for the purpose of some other.
Kenrya: Exactly. I did that lots.
Erica: My whole marriage.
Kenrya: Exact same.
Erica: The thing is, I'll start with my marriage and work backwards, but even with my marriage, it was one of those things where it was like, "It's easier if I behave this way or do these things," because it's just easier on the sake of being easier for the relationship.
Kenrya: It's a go along to get along.
Erica: I have realized that if I can't be exactly who the fuck I am in a relationship, I just don't need to be in that relationship. Some of it was like I grew and changed and outgrew particular ideas, actions, activities, and still held on to, not even wanted to, but still held on to them, because that's what kept us together. I could tell y’all, some things I have the most, skateboarding, intricate knowledge of, because it's like, I was with a nigga that did it, so I did it too. Really, nigga? No.
Kenrya: There's nothing wrong with supporting what your partners do or learning a little bit about their shit, to show interest, in the same ways that we would expect them to show some interest in us and our work. It's just when you cross over to the point where that shit replaces the other shit.
Erica: You're selling tee-shirts after his fucking ... You selling Muck Muck and the Scuzzy band crew tee-shirts at a damn-
Kenrya: Trying to get your friends to buy CDs.
Erica: I wasn't going to say that. Doing shit like missing homecoming for a nigga. Have I ever missed homecoming for a nigga? I never have, but it's just things that are so integral to who you are.
Kenrya: I've only missed homecoming-
Erica: I'm going to dial that back.
Kenrya: ... for one person. It was for a friend on her birthday.
Erica: Yeah, and she was like, "Okay, I'm done with that! Back to homecoming!" I definitely have. Most of it I look back and it's cringey, because it's like, oh my god, I can't believe I did that shit, but then I hear Kenrya in my ear saying, "You know what? You know better, you do better." Now I know better and so I do better, but it's definitely a cringey experience to think about all the bullshit that I found myself involved in or doing, just because I want to seem like I give a fuck about something. I remember I dated this musician and found ... It wasn't roots reggae. Oh, you know what? There was a roots reggae nigga. Remember, we went to a roots ... Was it that show we went to see?
Kenrya: No, it wasn't the roots, but it was some-
Erica: It was Dead Prez?
Kenrya: It wasn't. Fuck.
Erica: Somebody in Philly.
Kenrya: Was it Brand Nubian? No, it wasn't, because we used to do roots reggae, but we also used to do that old-school rap, like Hotep ass-
Erica: Yeah! That's why I was thinking maybe it was Dead Prez, which I like Dead Prez.
Kenrya: It wasn't Dead Prez, because I like Dead Prez. It was somewhere in that New York old-school hip-hop realm. We did, we went on a double-date in Philly with two niggas that ain't...
Erica: Ain't around no more. I spent the summer going to reggae concerts and acting like I knew how to wind. Had I still been fucking with him, I probably could do a proper air horn. I'm from the fucking Midwest. I can get maybe a good five, 10-minute reggae set and then I'm ready to go. I'm like, "Okay, put on “Back That Ass Up.” Put on “Project Bitch.” Come on."
Kenrya: I got it if we stick with the classics, the crowd movers, the mainstream shit.
Erica: The problematic, gay-bashing ones? Yeah. Exactly.
Kenrya: That's hard to listen to at this point.
Erica: Exactly. I dated that guy that aligned closely with your roots reggae guy. I dated an indie musician. That summer was interesting, doing indie musician shit around the D.C. area. I don't like it. Dated some old nigga.
Kenrya: You always date old niggas.
Erica: That's par for the course, but anyway. I look back and it's so cringey. If y’all got a picture of some random EDM laser set DJ booth situation and you see a picture of me in the background, just know she was fucking with some nigga.
Kenrya: I went to a rave in D.C. and I got burned with a cigarette and I was like, "Fuck this, I'm leaving."
Erica: I got burnt with a cigarette at Dream and I felt like the nastiest ... Who the fuck gets burnt with a cigarette? It was on my arm, above my elbow, but on the outside. It clearly looked like a nigga put a cigarette out on my arm.
Kenrya: It did, put a cigarette out on you.
Erica: Then I'm at work trying to ... It's in the middle of the summer and I got my fucking cigarette burn arm.
Kenrya: Oh my gosh. Mine was on my hand. I left. I was like, "I'm not. This night's over."
Erica: You're like the dude in “Color Purple” that just shut down [inaudible 00:40:11].
Kenrya: Time to go!
Erica: Time to go!
Kenrya: Do you know how often I say that to myself? You also know that I will leave anywhere anytime.
Erica: Any-fucking-where. I saw a meme on Instagram, it was a picture of a dude that was like, "This is a universal sign I should've drove," or something like that. I saw it and I was like, "I miss being somewhere angry, mad that I didn't drive."
Kenrya: This is always why I always drive or I'm prepared to fucking Lyft home.
Erica: Here it's no big deal. If you in St. Louis, if you somewhere, you just stuck, bruh.
Kenrya: That's why I rent a car every time I go home, because I don't want to be on nobody else's schedule. Even if I'm here for literally a day, I got a car.
Erica: Having a hotel room is clutch because you're like, "I got to go change. I'll be back." I'm in there-
Kenrya: I don't even say that. [crosstalk 00:41:10].
Erica: ... with HBO watching me.
Kenrya: No no no. Remember when I first started going home again after I got into therapy and I had to put together my survival plan, and part of it is to always have a place of my own to lay my head and to always have my own vehicle and to not buy other niggas food, because then you end up buying food for a house full of niggas.
Erica: I do that. I do that. I do that because also my family is one of them, when I go home ... The first time I went home with my son, we had one suitcase, and he was gone with somebody else the whole time, so he was carrying stuff in a little trash bag, a little grocery bag. Now we're at the point when we travel there, he has his bag, I have my bag. The minute we get there, he's like one of my nieces and nephews, like, "Oh hey! Did you sleep well? Where y’all been?" It's like I don't even got a child until I get back, until we headed to the airport.
Kenrya: That's real. My kid often stays with my dad when I'm ... I'll be in my room by myself and it's lovely.
Kenrya: I have a question that goes a little bit back to what we were talking about before. We talked about how our families have been supportive or not or whatever when we were first starting dating. What's that look like for you now?
Erica: I don't invite them in much. Right after surgery, my aunt came and visited.
Kenrya: Oh, shit. I remember this.
Erica: My aunt came to visit. Then I had my guy friends, different guy friends coming by. They could either be a platonic guy friend or a guy friend that we was fucking. He just come and make sure I'm doing fine. Every single time my aunt was googly-eyed, like, "Oh, who's this? What's your name?"
Kenrya: She also did that with my partner. She also felt up.
Erica: Don't put it on the record, because he still say he going to sue. I think now that I'm older, I think my family has this like, "Erica's got to get married," or they want to see me partnered, because to them that's like, "She's got the house. She's got the kid. She had a divorce. Next things next is finding the right partner." It's like, yeah, that'd be cool, but I'm not in a rush. I had to have a frank discussion with my aunt. My mother's passed away, so that's why I refer to my aunts. I had to have a frank discussion with my aunt right after I got a divorce about the fact that I'm just fucking. These are guys that are nice and they're good friends, but we have sex, and I don't expect it to turn into anything. I don't want it to turn into anything. It took her a minute. By the end of the weekend she was like, "I wonder if I could have sex with [inaudible 00:44:31]."
Erica: Also, I recognized that in the family, I am one of the straitlaced, "She did well." All my cousins are doing well in their own lanes, but I was one that went off to college and yada yada.
Erica: I legitimize some things sometimes. Everybody in my family smoke weed, all the nieces and nephews. Everybody smoke weed. They thought that I didn't. I was like, "Nah, I smoke weed, and I have a really good job, and I'm doing well for myself." It went from smoking dope and reefer, like, "You smoke dope, don't you?" to like, "Some people smoke marijuana to relax and calm their anxieties." I try to be open about those things with my family, especially just as it comes to relationships, like, "I'm figuring it out," or, "I don't know," because I want them to see that. I want them to see all sides of me. I'm being more intentional about having them see all that makes up Erica. When I met my ex-husband, my mama was all googly-eyed over him. She was really supportive. My mom was more of a, "Bitch, if it tickles your pickle, I'm down for it." I think they're just more on the, "Let's find Erica a man," tip, but I made it very clear that life is good, nigga, it's real good, so I ain't finding no man that ain't worth disturbing this peace.
Kenrya: That's not going to make it even better.
Erica: Exactly. What about your family now?
Kenrya: They're really good. They're super supportive. They country. If it's my mom, she call my daughter her baby, and then what does she call him? I don't know. Some variant of that that makes it clear that she's talking about the man and not the child, "Where he at? What he doing? Put him on the phone." Then I got to go to the ... My family's super welcoming of really everybody.
Erica: I do know.
Kenrya: Everybody's like family.
Erica: Your daddy be like, "You want to leave your son here too?" I'm like, "We're going to another city." "He can stay until you get back!"
Kenrya: It's a very welcoming family. My dad loves having all the kids-
Erica: House full of kids.
Kenrya: ... around him. That's his shit. They're all just very in all the time. My dad, he's really my rock when it comes to stuff like that. When I have panic attacks, he's the one who talks me through them. Very often they were tied to relationship stuff. My PTSD is triggered by raggedy niggas. When I be up in the middle of the night all fucked up, he's the one who I can call and he would sit and talk me down so that I can go to sleep. It didn't used to be that way. It used to be that because I carried so much shame around the relationships that I had been in and the things that I felt like I had allowed to happen to me before I realized that those things are not in my control and that me having shame over something that somebody else does is stupid and that being vulnerable will allow me to have the support that I need to get through those things.
Kenrya: I wouldn't tell him when things were bad. When I was with men who were abusive in a lot of different ways, I wouldn't tell him, in part because I was ashamed, and because I wasn't sure what I was going to do and I didn't want him looking at me crazy, or sometimes because I didn't want him to hurt anybody, depending on his age and mine at the time. Even when I had an abortion, I didn't tell him, because I thought that he would feel a way, because he is socially conservative in that way, or at least he was.
Kenrya: It wasn't until I did a lot of work on myself and was able to have those really honest conversations with him that I was able to understand just how much he was in my corner. He told me he was really sad, and not in a manipulative way, but just a genuine, "Damn, I wish you had felt, and I'm sorry that I didn't do enough to make you know that you could always come to me, especially when shit is extra shitty." Knowing that makes it that much easier for me to go to him when things are rough. His only real way in at this point, not now that I'm in a relationship, but when I was dating, when I was on all the apps, he never wanted me to swipe on a cop. Military and cops he was very fucking-
Erica: ACAB, hashtag.
Kenrya: Very anti-
Erica: Hash brown.
Kenrya: Like, "No, nigga." He's always worried that they're going to have PTSD and fuck me up or that they have access to weapons. Domestic violence in cops-
Erica: Is really high.
Kenrya: ... is super high. That's a very real concern. I dated a military attorney at some point. He was like, "I'm here, but you need to shut that shit down." That's the only time when my daddy's like, "Nah, son."
Erica: I was going to say that. I didn't share the lows of relationships, and not that I share too much of the details, because I also recognize when I am saying one thing to my family, I'm speaking into this mic and talking to the entire world. I was hesitant to take my L's publicly with my family. When I decided to separate from my ex-husband, I didn't tell my family for months. I think we separated in November and I think I might've told them-
Kenrya: Yes, it was November.
Erica: It was definitely November. I think I told them maybe March, April. I talk to somebody in my family-
Kenrya: Every day.
Erica: ... easily once a day. My sister knew, and she knew to keep it quiet. She might've told them, but they ain't say nothing to me, just because it was one of those things where I felt like I needed to figure it out without extra noise. I have gotten a lot better at placing those boundaries with my family where I wouldn't hesitate to tell them now, just because they know, if I say, "I don't need your input," I will hang up on you before you keep talking. I'm a lot more willing to take my L's, because when I did tell them, they were like, "Everything was so perfect!" It was like, "No, not really, this shit's been breaking down for years, and I just didn't share it with y’all." I try to live my life with my family, but also just among friends and just in life, as an open book, more to help ... I hate to sound like I am a martyr and I need people to know and serve as an example, but I want to serve as an example of somebody just trying to figure this shit out as she goes along with pure intentions. Sometimes that shit works and sometimes it don't.
Kenrya: We've talked about this on this show I think with a guest last season. So much of how your family said, "Everything was perfect," that's so much of what everyone presents online. People, especially younger folks, get this idea that for a relationship to be great, it has to be perfect, and that there are never any lows and there are never any days when you want to wring a nigga's neck.
Erica: I just got on TikTok. I do not post dances.
Kenrya: Okay, old bitch.
Erica: I know, I am the old bitch, but I love just scrolling through, because the kids these days-
Kenrya: Our friends in our group, y’all keep posting in-
Erica: They are funny.
Kenrya: I just watched a bunch of those this morning and I didn't think they were that funny, but all right.
Erica: Actually, I will tell you, there is another group that you're not even on, and literally all we do is swap TikToks.
Kenrya: Yes, please leave me.
Erica: Oh, we know that you don't. When it's conversation, we go back to that same group, but when we doing just TikTok swaps, it's another one.
Kenrya: That's fine.
Erica: I've noticed that there are tons of couples on TikTok that make these cute little things, and then it makes everyone want to ... I feel like because I have a young person
Kenrya: You get into that goals thing, all that bullshit.
Erica: ... who I adore. She is just so sweet and cute and smart and all of that. She's in a relationship and serious about it. They've been together for years. I saw this meme on Instagram. It was like, "Girl, you 19, quit trying to be a wife and go be a hoe."
Kenrya: That's a whole word.
Erica: Yo, that is what it is, because now I think back about as we talk among our friend groups and stuff, not the ones that ... Were any in a long-term relationship? Shit, you!
Kenrya: Some of them felt like they lost out on their hoe years, but I had my hoe years.
Erica: You hear, "Oh my God, we were doing all this in college," and so-and-so be like, "I was at that nigga house. We was at the cookout," and that kind of thing. I have another young person in my life who is in a very serious relationship, but I see her doing bald-headed hoe shit with her girlfriends.
Kenrya: Oh, good.
Erica: I love it, because I'm like, "I don't want you to miss out on-"
Erica: "... living life."
Kenrya: Figuring out who the hell you are.
Erica: Exactly, because it's cute to be couple goals and stuff. Speaking of things missing out on, things we feel like we missed out on, we've talked about losing our virginity and our first sexual experiences and things. Not really our first sexual experiences but losing our virginity.
Kenrya: We talked about first anal.
Erica: I told you how I lost my virginity. You told me how you lost yours.
Kenrya: Waterbed. Yours was a waterbed situation.
Erica: You ain't got to give people those kind of details. You go back to the first episode and turn that on, y’all will hear about my waterbed experience. Anyway, the one thing that I loved about this scene that we read was that you could tell that their sexual exploration was full of desire. I feel like the first time I had sex, it was because I was more curious about it, as opposed to wanting. Now that I'm older, I know what it feels like to want some dick, like, "I want that dick in me-"
Kenrya: Right now.
Erica: "... now." Exactly. You can feel that written in what Fiona wrote between Ny and Duni. You could feel that she wanted that desire.
Kenrya: There's longing just jumping off the page there.
Erica: When I think back to my first time, it was definitely just a, "Here's a dick. Let's see how this goes." I, again, go back to just when I talk to my kids about sex and virginity, like, "I don't need you to wait until marriage. I want you to wait until-"
Kenrya: I don't even think that's a good idea.
Erica: "... you want to do it." I ain't fucking [crosstalk 00:56:56].
Kenrya: That's how you get stuck. No, thank you.
Erica: It was so cool how she wrote that. It just made me feel like I truly missed out on that. Again, now that I'm an adult, bitch. I definitely didn't feel that the first time that I had sex. It was not like a, "Oh, I need this thing." Because also I think that's part of what makes how it happens. It's like I'm feeling this pulsing down in my pussy. Have you seen that, it's this clip on Vine or something, and it's these two chicks, two white chicks, sitting in their car eating. It was a McDonald's mukbang and a chick has a plate of McDonald's hotcakes, and she pours syrup on it, and they both real quiet looking at her pouring syrup on it. Then she look at her girl friend, she said, "That made my pussy throb."
Erica: I hate it but I love it, because that's me. This is my total just Erica explanation. That's how sex the first time is good when it's like-
Kenrya: Yeah, but I wonder for how many people is that actually the case. I know for me, especially when you're younger, for me it was honestly dutiful. It was like we had been playing just the tip a little bit.
Erica: $5 a month level.
Kenrya: I was a planner. It was like, "Okay, it's prom night. I got this hotel room. I got condoms. I got spermicidal lubricant." Which I found out that day that I'm allergic to.
Erica: That just sounds like a raw pussy.
Kenrya: It was regular condoms with lubricant and then additional.
Erica: Exactly. That's why I'm like that sounds like a raw pussy.
Kenrya: I had very serious goals. I wasn't trying to get pregnant and trapped by no nigga, but did find out I was allergic to that. It was very much like, "Okay, this is the plan. I have to do the plan." By the time we got to that point, one part of it was that his expectation was there, because he'd been waiting all this time. My expectation was there, because I had been waiting for this perfect, quote unquote, moment, but prom was lackluster, because I was on the committee. I was tired. By the time we got back to the hotel I was exhausted. I ain't really feel like doing nothing, but the anticipation was there, because it was what I was supposed to do, and then it hurt. It was just like, "I'm doing this thing I'm supposed to do." I wasn't really feeling him that night. He wasn't a great date. I didn't have fun with him. There was no longing that I could no longer ignore.
Erica: Now that I think about it, my first kiss was the same way. I think it was more just curiosity. Again, this is why I think sex ed is so important with kids, because I really didn't have those conversations. I was like, "I wonder what it's going to be like." I think maybe you'll still have those, "I wonder what it's going to be like," when you know all the details about it.
Kenrya: Yeah, because it's still nothing-
Erica: That you got to experience.
Kenrya: [crosstalk 01:00:46] just going to feel. How old were you when you had your first kiss?
Erica: About 13, 14.
Kenrya: Bitch, I was in the second grade.
Erica: With the tongue?
Kenrya: I don't think so.
Erica: My first tongue kiss-
Kenrya: I don't remember tongue kiss.
Erica: Oh my God. My first tongue kiss, we talked about this with another guest.
Kenrya: With Rock Biter?
Erica: Yeah. My mama was gone. My mama was working. Rock Biter and his friend came over and was sitting on the couch. I could feel the scratchiness. We had one of those, not thread couches but you know.
Kenrya: I know exactly what you talking about.
Erica: Rock Biter still had on his coat, and he leaned over. This nigga's teeth was like this. He had a overlapped, crowded, crossbite teeth. He kissed me, and nigga, all it was was spit. I think I forever been scarred, because I still-
Kenrya: [crosstalk 01:01:56].
Erica: It was more I wanted to kiss him out of curiosity, because it wasn't even like we stole a kiss because we were so into each other. It's like we were sitting there and my mama wasn't home and so it was like, "Let's kiss." My brother was in the kitchen fighting his home boy over a box of Fruity Pebbles.
Kenrya: Dude, I don't remember my first real, real kiss.
Erica: Because it didn't scar you.
Kenrya: Or it did.
Erica: If I dumped a box of tarantulas in your lap, you'll remember that shit.
Kenrya: Not necessarily. The brain protects us. It's a lot of stuff I don't remember because it was traumatic.
Erica: Brain, why the fuck ain't you do that to me, because it's so hard for me to kiss people.
Kenrya: I've had some really bad kissing experiences, but I don't remember the first. I remember I kissed this dude who it was like he was trying to eat my face. He was really bad. He kept wanting to do it.
Erica: See, I think Rock Biter's teeth got in the way. He didn't know how to ...
Kenrya: Tuck them away.
Erica: Ah! Ah!
Erica: (singing) Okay. Speaking of things that get us wet ...
Kenrya: Nice transition.
Erica: We are going to now turn to our new segment called What's Turning Us On. The thing that is turning us on this week, I don't think I've shared this with you. I don't think you've used this, Kenrya. I remember we were talking a while back and you were saying after sex your partner jumps in the shower and he's washing all the toys and stuff. Sometimes a bitch don't feel like doing that, but you can't be having little crusty toys laying around. The thing that I really like that's turning me on is called Classic Erotica Before and After Adult Toy Cleaner. It's a spray. You spray it on your toys and you wipe it off and you can put them away. I always do a good cleaning once the weed wear off and I wake up or something. Sometimes post-sex, again, y’all know I'm anal and I got to brush my teeth, I got to do my skin care routine, all of that, but sometimes you want to just bask in the glow. It's nice having this toy cleaner, because you literally ... It reminds you of that spray.
Kenrya: You sound like them VSCO girls. I hate it. That's my life.
Erica: Let's not refer to VSCO girls as I discuss my sex toy cleaner.
Erica: It reminds you of that eyeglass spray.
Kenrya: That stuff works.
Erica: It's a spray and it's really good to clean your toys.
Kenrya: It's nontoxic? If you don't wash them with soap in between, you not going to be all itchy?
Erica: Yep. It kills germs, E. coli, staph, all of that. You can use it before and after on toys, because also I keep my toys in a big box. I have an extensive nipple clamp collection now.
Kenrya: Look at you.
Erica: Only for me to have nipples that can't-
Kenrya: Come over to the-
Erica: Only for me to have nipples that can't feel shit!
Kenrya: Maybe it'll ... I don't know.
Erica: It's going to literally ... I was on a message board, and someone was like, "10 years ago-"
Kenrya: It won't come back?
Erica: "10 years ago I had a mastectomy and I felt something in my titty for the first time today." Thankfully my titties will still be upright by then.
Kenrya: Sure will.
Erica: I have a bunch of nipple clamps that have feathers on them. Sometimes if I don't put those away right, then my dildo will have feathers on them. Having that spray is good to use before using it, just spray it off real quick and that kind of thing. I really like it, because it's 10 bucks. We'll include it on our website, a link on our website so that you can get it. It has made just getting nasty a lot less nasty, because if you got, like me-
Kenrya: That could be their slogan.
Erica: Getting nasty a lot less nasty, because also a lot of times with your toys you're using different lubes and then there's body juices and all of that, and you just want to spray them off and put them away and not think you going to come back to a-
Kenrya: Sticky mess.
Erica: Exactly. That's what's turning me on. You like it, Killa?
Kenrya: Yeah. It sounds dope. Actually, I think I will get some, because sometimes I do just want to spray it and throw it back in the bag.
Erica: Set it and forget it.
Kenrya: Forget it. On that note ...
Erica: This has been The Turn On, with your home girls Erica and Killa, two hoes-
Kenrya: Two hoes-
Erica: ... making it clap.
Kenrya: ... making it clap. No.
Erica: You didn't pull up your hands. Two hoes making it clap. Okay, never mind. Bye, y'all.
Kenrya: This episode was produced by us, Kenrya and Erica, and edited by B'Lystic. The theme song is from Brazy. We want to hear from y’all. Send recommendations for books you want us to read on the show and all the questions that you want us to answer related to sex and all the other stuff. You can send those to TheTurnOnPodcast@gmail.com. Please take a moment to review the show, five stars only please, and subscribe to us in your favorite podcast app. Then follow us on Twitter @TheTurnOnPod and Instagram @TheTurnOnPodcast and head over to TheTurnOnPodcast.com to find links to the books that we feature, transcripts of our shows and info on all the guests that we talk about. Bye.
The Turn On
The Turn On is a podcast for Black people who want to get off. To open their minds. To learn. To be part of a community. To show that we love and fuck too, and it doesn't have to be political or scandalous or dirty. Unless we want it to be.